Homer.

This is coolbert:

Here is the type of exaggeration for which the defector/writer Suvorov has been criticized?!

From Suvorov, "Inside the Soviet Army":

"the Soviet Army is a present evolving techniques for using helicopters for fuel resupply. . . A V-12 helicopter lands, carry 40 or more tons of fuel. Within ten minutes in has refuelled all the tanks [in a single battalion] and taken off again . . . A single V-12 helicopter flying at low altitude at a speed of 250 kilometers and hour, can refuel a whole division in one day . . . While a single truck carrying ten tons would take twenty-four hours to make a particular journey, a helicopter could do the same job in one hour."

In this particular instance, Victor is speaking of the Soviet V-12 helicopter. "Homer" using the NATO code name.



"Homer" was indeed a wonderment. The largest [even to this day] helicopter ever built. Holds [even to this day] a variety of world records for the type aircraft.

"The Soviet made Mil Mi-12 (Also known as the V-12, NATO reporting name "Homer") is the largest helicopter ever built."

"Although only two examples of the Mil Mi-12 were built, both being V-12 prototypes, this giant machine is worthy of mention as the world's largest helicopter to have flown to date . . . on 6 August 1969, the V-12 lifted a payload of 40204.5kg to a height of 2255m, establishing a record that remains unbeaten."

Was NOT originally conceived as a helicopter that would fulfill a re-fuelling role.

"Development came about as a need for a heavy lift helicopter capable of carrying major missile components."

In addition, NEVER ENTERED INTO PRODUCTION. Only two prototypes were ever built, and that was that. Another instance of the Soviets scaring the wits out of NATO planners. A threat that never materialized.

"It is to date the world's largest helicopter and flew for the first time in 1968, but did not enter production."

The maintenance requirements for this "beast" must have been formidable. These V-12 helicopters were not cost efficient. Great for photo opportunities but that is about it!

Please see also this photo of a German World War Two [WW2] transport helicopter, Fa-223.



There is, again, a remarkable similarity between the two designs. One [V-12], much larger of course, but similar, nonetheless!!

coolbert.

Victor Suvorov IV [Conclusion].

This is coolbert:

And yet more comments of mine regarding the wiki for Victor Suvorov. As usual, my observations in BOLD!

Also once more regarding numbers and Suvorov being prone to exaggeration:

"in 1941, Red Army had a million trained paratroopers. These kinds of figures have been dismissed by most historians"

Here definition is important? 1 million parachutists as opposed to paratroopers would be a better way of saying it. Persons HAVING A FAMILIARITY WITH PARACHUTING BUT NOT A PARATROOPER in the western sense of the word. A parachutist, widely varied with regard to training and actual jump status.

NOT persons in all cases totally jump qualified and being classified as a PARATROOPERS according to the western model.

Suvorov does speak of a SOVIET PARACHUTE PSYCHOSIS!!

The Soviets DID a lot of innovative work, pre-World War Two, in the training and employment of parachutists for various military and non-military missions. Smoke-jumpers were originally a Soviet invention. Training carried out by dropping from towers, balloons, or even persons standing over enormous fans and being BLOWN UPWARDS WHILE WEARING OPENED PARACHUTES!!

"By 1936, there were 559 parachute towers in the Soviet Union and 115 parachute training schools. In that same year members of Osoaviakhim and other civilians made 1,600,000 jumps from towers and 30,000 jumps from planes."

[in 1936, there were ZERO parachute towers in the U.S.??!! Also notice the statistics. Fifty times as many jumps from towers as from planes!!]

"As a result of this intensive civilian training program, it is estimated that in 1940, over a million Soviet men and women were trained parachutists."

[trained parachutists as opposed to paratroopers??]

The first deployable paratrooper units ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD were Soviet!! Indeed! For conventional and special purpose military operations.

I think it can be safely said that the Soviets DID possess A LOT of individuals that would qualify in any army as a paratrooper. Getting them to the target with adequate transport would be the problem.

" [the] reality of available fuel or transportation."

Right, not enough transport aircraft or aviation gas to get 1 million paratroopers to the targets.

Definitions are always important. In this case too?? Again, Suvorov exaggerates, but NOT excessively so!!??

coolbert.

Victor Suvorov III.

This is coolbert:

Once more, comments of mine regarding the wiki for Victor Suvorov. As usual, my observations in BOLD!

Regarding numbers and Suvorov being prone to exaggeration:

"Suvorov has also been criticized being prone to exaggeration about number and capabilities of Soviet forces and weapons. For example, he claims that USSR planned to build 100,000 or more Su-2 attack aircraft in case of mobilization (actual number built: around 800)"

This is a misleading argument.

Suvorov is not necessarily wrong about the figures. The Soviets PLANNED TO BUILD 100,000 Su-2. Did want to build that many. Did not, but not because they were unable to. By 1941 the Su-2 was obsolete.

"Although over 800 Su-2s and Su-4s were built, the aircraft was obsolete and underarmed by the start of World War II, and was quickly replaced"

Replaced by the Il-2, a much more robust ground attack aircraft. The Soviets did build enormous numbers of the Il-2. Consider this regarding the Il-2:

"The Ilyushin Il-2 Shturmovik (Russian: Ил-2 Штурмовик) . . . produced by the Soviet Union in huge numbers . . . a total of 36,163 were built, making it the single most produced military aircraft design in all of aviation history"

The Il-2, it must be remembered, only was produced in the numbers that it was AFTER the movement of entire factories to areas east of the Ural. Moving those factories, getting them back in production, and then producing the numbers of Il-2 that were built WAS a significant feat!! NOT 100,000, but STILL a large number [over 36,000!].

Suvorov has a tendency to exaggerate? Perhaps, but not excessively so!!

coolbert.

Victor Suvorov II

This is coolbert:

More on the wiki entry for Victor Suvorov.

[Again, my comments in BOLD!]

"Support for Suvorov's claim that Stalin had been preparing a strike against Hitler in 1941 began to emerge, as some archive materials [Soviet archival material] were declassified. Authors to support assault thesis are V.D.Danilov, V.A.Nevezhin, Constantine Pleshakov and B.V. Sokolov [all Russian authors]. As the latter has noted, the absence of documents with the precise date of the planned Soviet invasion can't be an argument in favor of the claim that this invasion was not planned at all.

Critics [of Suvorov] would say - - "where is the smoking gun!!?? We want to see the actual attack order for the invasion of eastern Europe by Soviet forces. NO document, no verification"

"Although the USSR attacked Finland, there are no documents found, which would indicate November 26, 1939 as the previously assumed date for beginning of the provocations or November 30 as the date of the planned Soviet assault."

Dig that!! NO documents can be found in Soviet archives that support the provocations and attack plans that led to the Soviet invasion of Finland - - 1940!! Lack of documentation notwithstanding - - the war did occur!!

Some special comments with regard to archival documents and such.

There is an entire school of historiography that places great stress and weight on the usage of ORIGINAL SOURCE DOCUMENTS. This is the RANKEIAN SCHOOL. Named after the German historian, Leopold von Ranke.

"his·to·ri·og·ra·phy –noun

2. the body of techniques, theories, and principles of historical research and presentation; methods of historical scholarship.
3. the narrative presentation of history based on a critical examination, evaluation, and selection of material from primary and secondary sources and subject to scholarly criteria."

This particular school discounts to a degree memories, recollection, anecdotal accounts of history. Such sources are said to be secondary in the attempt to understand “WHAT OCCURRED”.

The Rankeian School searches for and attempts to find the original source documents concerning historical events. Prefers documentation over
“memories”, “recollections”, “anecdotal accounts”.

[Venice, the Papacy, Prussia were among the topics of Ranke’s historical research. Ranke did have access to voluminous archives that were well maintained, cataloged, and exhaustive in content. In such a situation, the Ranke School of historiography works well!!?? RANKE WAS DEALING WITH AN IDEAL SITUATION THAT IS NOT ALWAYS TO BE FOUND!?]

However, the Ranke methodology is fraught with danger in many circumstances?

Practices as engaged in by governments and governmental functionaries that greatly complicate and distort in many instances histories by those adhering to the Rankeian School methodology!

One such practice is that of “weeding”. The deliberate destruction of documents from archival files that are “felt” to be incriminating, controversial, suspect, contentious, or embarrassing!!

[think of Oliver North and Fawn Hall from modern times!!]

Or, the process by which entire files or folders of files are CONDENSED into a smaller, more digestible package. CONDENSED in a fashion at the whim of the person working with the archives. In such instances, subjectivity rules here over objectivity??!!

[in modern parlance, “spin” would be the operative word when condensing!!??]

And the insertion into files, deliberately and maliciously so [how else could it be looked at], of downright forgeries INTENDED TO MISLEAD researchers.

From the book "Intrepid's Last Case":

"The paper-handlers scavenged for incriminating papers to burn . . . They removed the diary notes of a prime minister . . . They tampered with reports . . . They deleted, they disguised, they distorted in accordance with their own changing rules."

"His [Sir Charles Ellis] new SIS task was to weed, or edit, secret records and to put them 'in order'"

"'I [Ellis] am taking the opportunity to slip a few bits of paper into the files.'" - - C. Ellis.

And here - - according to the historian Norman Stone:

"allegedly critical evidence of the crime consists of forgeries. The British were in occupation of Istanbul for four years after the war and examined all the files of the Ottoman government. They found nothing, and therefore could not try the 100-odd supposed Turkish war ciminals that they were holding. Then, documents turned up allegedly telegrams from the interior ministry to the effect that all Armenians should be wiped out. The signatures turned out to be wrong, there were no back-up copies in the archives and the dating system was misunderstood."

The British - - in the aftermath of World War One, sought incriminating documents that could be used to try suspected Turkish war criminals. NO supporting documents could be found!! When some were found - - were demonstrably forgeries!!

Someone [Turks??] had first - - weeded the files - - and then someone [British??] - - had inserted forgeries!!??

Can you dig it??!!

coolbert.

Victor Suvorov I.

This is coolbert:

Looked over carefully the wiki entry on Victor Suvorov.

Have some definite comments. [as usual, my comments in BOLD!]

Suvorov as a writer has been both prolific and controversial. Controversial especially with regard to "M Day".

"M-Day (Russian: День „М”) is a book by Viktor Suvorov about supposed Soviet Army preparations for the invasion of Germany. Author argues that the Soviet Army was preparing to attack the Germans when Hitler forestalled Stalin on June 22, 1941."

Stalin was going to send the Red Army west in July 1941. Invade eastern Europe, attack German forces, defeat same, and make a dash for the English channel? So says Victor.

The plans had been drawn, the troops [Soviet] were in readiness, and THEN, Hitler and the Wehrmacht strike first. With devastating consequences for the Soviet Union.

To say the least, this "theory" expounded upon by Suvorov has a lot of critics.

It should be noted, however, that Victor was not the first to propose that Stalin intended to move west in July of 1941.

"The idea about Stalin's preparations to strike prior to the Axis invasion was proposed earlier by dissident Pyotr Grigorenko"

"They [Stalinists] also have no explanation as to how it happened that the well-known song "The Holy War" was written by Stalin's order before the German invasion, or why millions of copies of the famous placard "Your Native Country calls" were printed also before the German invasion. The answer to these questions is simple: Stalin and his generals did not plan to defend the Soviet Union, on the contrary, they had planned their own invasion [of western Europe], but neglected to anticipate the possibility of similar treachery on the part of the Germans." - - P. Grigorenko.

A lot of credence has to be given to the observations of Grigorenko. DID fight with honor and distinction on the Eastern Front as a general officer in the Red Army. Subsequent to the end of the war [WW2], was a senior instructor and lecturer at the Frunze Academy.

Suvorov did expound on the theory of "M Day', with facts and considerable research. An inference regarding "Big Red moves west" has been made that is correct?

As I have said before, the controversy over "M Day" is just too "hot a potato" for the experts and the historians to handle. The entire history of WW2 would have to be re-written and re-evaluated??!!

coolbert.

Genghis.

This is coolbert:

Victor Suvorov is mistaken about Genghis Khan? To catch the Soviet defector and prolific writer [really prolific AND controversial!!!] on all things military - - Suvorov - - in an error - - is an accomplishment?

From Victor - - "Inside The Soviet Army":

"During a battle Jenghiz Khan would keep a close watch on the situation from a nearby hill. As soon as the slightest sign of success was visible at any point, he would concentrate all his forces there, sometimes even throwing in his own personal guard. having broken through the enemy's line at a single point he would push irresistibly ahead and the enemy's army, split in two, would disintegrate. it is worth recording that he never lost a battle in his [Jenghiz] life."

NOT So!! Twice Genghis was defeated.

[thanks here to Trevor Dupuy.]

"The first of Genghis Khan's two defeats took place in 1203, when he was still known as Temuchin, chief of the Borjigen, one of the several Mongolian tribes. This was at the hands of the Kerait Mongols under Toghrul Khan"

"[in 1213 - - the second defeat], Genghis Khan learned about a palace coup within the Chin capital. The eunuch general Hu Sha-hu had rebelled against Emperor Wei-wang, killed him, seized power, and installed another Chin prince on the throne. Learning about these events, Genghis Khan marched on the Chin capital in expectation of taking the city easily. Approaching Peking, while crossing a river, his army was ambushed and defeated by a larger Chinese army under General Hu Sha-hu."

Even an expert, such as Victor [Vladimir Rezun], can be wrong??

Sure!!

coolbert.

Translation.

This is coolbert:

As an experiment, I took the biography text in Russian from the Victor Suvorov web site. Placed the text, again in Russian, into the Babel Fish translator web site and got the translation. Pretty interesting stuff. Now, let us see how accurate the translation from Russian to English is. Here goes!!

Translation from Russian to English via Babel Fish:

My comments in bold in parans as thus [my comments].

"Read chapters [You can read??] from the new book about marshal Zhukov [Marshal Zhukov] . The book is not yet published in Russia, but the large part of the text is already accessible on our site [the site is in Russian of course].

Victor Suvorov nastoyashcheye [my nom de plume is] are Name [real name is] - Vladimir bogdanovich Rezun. It [HE] were borne [was born] in 1947. Finished Kalinin Suvorov military and Kiev high general military command school. He was the officer for the intelligence division of the staff of military district. Since 1970 - in the nomenclature of the CC CPSU [Central Committee Communist Party Soviet Union]. In 1974 it [he] finished Military- diplomatic academy. Four years worked in Geneva rezidenture GRU. [ autobiography ] In 1978 it [he] ran [fled for his life] to Great Britain. It [He] is externally in THE USSR sentenced to the shooting [is sentenced in abstentia to death by shooting].

Author of best-sellers "ice-breaker" and "aquarium", and also the numerous books on the history World War II [ of the book ]

NEWS: 30.04.05 Victor Suvorov participated in the program of the Russian service the BBC "sevaoborot", dedicated to 60- anniversary from the day of Hitler's suicide. Program was built on the material of Suvorov's book "suicide".

02.04.05 v division "enemies and allies", by amiable authorization of the author, is published the article Of k.Zakoretskogo "Khu are yu? (with the English phrase book... on Smolenskaya Oblast)"from the site" Z- history ".

17.03.05 are published chapters from the new book about marshal Zhukov. The book yet did not leave in the press in Russia, but you already can read its almost complete text on our site!

Suvorov.com - Only Official Site Of Victor Suvorov. All materials on the site are published on its initiative and are edited by them personally.

Biography It [He] were borne [was born] on 20 April, 1947. Settlement Barabash Of Khasan The region Of Primorskiy Kray. Father - artilleryman. 72-1 guard of Aleksandr nevskiy's order the mortar regiment of the 5th army of Far-Eastern military district. It [He] is discharged from the army in 1959 on the Krushchev reduction. Major. The elder brother of 27 years blew [flew??] in the rocket forces. It [He] were discharged in 1991. Lieutenant Colonel. Its target run of 4 began into 11 years [???]. Voronezh Suvorov military school 1958-63. Kalinin - 1963-65.

The Kiev general military command twice red banner college of the name of Frunze 1965-68 (it [he] entered the second course). The international duty - 1968. Storozhenetskiy range of Carpathian military district, the 1st battalion 145- GO [??] of guard Budapest training motorized rifle regiment (training the sergeants of combat reconnaissance) - 1968-70. The reconnaissance staff section of Volga military district and 808-4 individual army reconnaissance company is Special Force 1970-1971. Military- diplomatic academy 1971-74. Geneva diplomatic rezidentura GRU 1974-1978. High treason - on 10 June, 1978.

It [he] is married. Once and for all [this is his only marriage and will be the only one]. Already 32 years [has been married for 32 years]. Wife - finding for the spy [??]. Encounter - on the alarming cross-roads of military intelligence [??]. Thus, it was [she is] called by Tatiana. The same name bore the first Soviet A-bomb [first Soviet atomic bomb was also called Tatiana]. Was completely called it not by Tamara, as some researchers of my creation asserted [some have thought the first Soviet atomic bomb was called Tamara, this is not so]. (this 4 about the wife, but not about the bomb) [this particular entry in his bio is about his wife, not the bomb] in all my books about it only one line in the "aquarium" - ringing girl of the inspection team [evidently his wife is mentioned only time in all his books, as a "ringing girl of the inspection team [a telephone operator of an inspection team??]] By it they are dedicated "aquarium" and "control" - is better, which succeeded for me in this life [a perfect match between him and his wife thanks to the GRU??]. Children two - daughter and the son of grandsons two [two children and two grandsons]. Thus far. My contemporary life measured off. Monotonic [he leads a very boring and dull life]. I read from the morning and I write. In the daytime I read and I write. In the evening I read and I write. At night - also. Interruptions to the breakfast, the dinner, supper and sleep [he only takes breaks to eat and sleep]. Most attentive reader of the "Red Star" [reads the Soviet military magazine]. Main tool - scissors. I cut out interesting [cuts out interesting articles to save]. I sign date and - into the box. It isolated special room for the metallic boxes of large and small: "tanks", "aviation", "fleet". "Generals", "plans and concepts", "fortified districts", etc., etc. when box will be overfilled, I rake contents to the new boxes: "heavy tanks", "average", "lungs", "floating", "engines", "tank guns", etc. and so forth. At the necessary moment [when needed] the assembled together [are put together in a cogent form] quotations must be simply rewritten with the commentaries. It is it's a pity only, that the ideal rhythm constantly is disrupted [he has a lot of disruptions that cause breaks in his routine]. It is necessary to read lecture, to lose time at the examinations, to hurry about 0 0N throughout the world [do the normal mundane aspects of life]. The books is written much. From them it is published by 13. Sport - run to the distant distances [he does distance running]. Dream - to pass londonkiy Marathon in the gas mask with the complete computation: with the automaton, the fire unit, the shovel and other [his goal is to run the London Marathon wearing a full battle kit. To include an AK-47 and other web gear, and do so in boots [don't think it will happen!!]]. It is understandable: in the boots. I gather [collect] Russian and Soviet combat orders [operational plans?? or is this medals??]. Furthermore - small arms [is a collector of small arms]. With Soviet orders not it was rewarded, since rewarding - afterward return from the mission. Accurately as cosmonauts they reward after landing. But 4 it did not land. However, it is rewarded with the highest state rewards of the number of states, including of those, which earlier counted by Soviet republics or brothers on sotslagu [this stuff about rewards and cosmonauts does not make a lot of sense??!!].

Books

Aquarium

Liberator

Ice-breaker

Day "M" last republic is purification suicide the shadow of victory control the selection

Books in the foreign languages

Inside the Soviet Army

Spetsnaz

Soviet Military Intelligence

Not published

Chapters from the second part of the book "shadow of victory"

to Beer its words conversely [this does not make sense at all??]

why in America there is no external reconnaissance? [no external espionage [CIA??]]"

Well, as you can see, there is a LOT about the translation that is to be desired. A LOT. But the gist is at least present. I have corrected as best I can do according to my appreciation of the context and the wording. Babel Fish is NOT and probably CANNOT be 100 % perfect. NO translation can be. Some are more accurate than others, but 100 %?? NO!!

So, what can we tell about Victor from his bio??

That he was born in 1947.

His father was a career military man, an artilleryman who was discharged in 1959 as a Major.

Victor has a brother who retired in 1991 as a Lt. Col. from the rocket forces.

Victor held a variety of military posts and in 1974 was graduated from the GRU [military intelligence] training course for intelligence officers.

Was posted overseas and worked for four years in the residency of the GRU in Austria.

Defected to Great Britain in 1978 for unspecified reasons.

Is married to Tatiana, has two children and two grandsons.

He met his wife through some association with the GRU.

Most of Victor's life is very dull and boring.

He reads and writes most of the day, with breaks for meals and sleeps.

He collects small arms and is a distance runner.

His goal is to run the London Marathon in full combat gear, to include an AK-47 and full web equipment!!!

Seems to lead a fairly normal life, with one exception.

FOR HIS DEFECTION, HE HAS BEEN SENTENCED IN ABSTENTIA TO DEATH BY SHOOTING!!! [He must live a life similar to that of Salman Rushdie??!!].

If you are interested in trying your own translations using Babel Fish, go to this web site http://babelfish.altavista.com/

Does work pretty good. But as I have said, not 100 %.

coolbert.

Icebreaker.

This is coolbert;

More on the thoughts of Suvorov from "Icebreaker":

[my comments in bold]

"Stalin raised 125 new infantry divisions, 30 new motorized divisions, and 61 tank and 79 air divisions -- a total of 295 divisions organized in 16 armies."

The air divisions were organized into Air Armies. Each front [grouping of armies], would be supported by an Air Army. Ground support aircraft intended to support the ground offensive. Soviet Air Force was meant almost exclusively for ground support, not having a strategic branch.

[Soviet divisions were organized into armies, and armies into fronts. A front was a collection of armies. We call it an Army Group, an archaic formation now].

"By June 1941, the Soviet navy had more than 218 submarines in service, with another 91 under construction. Stalin commanded the world's largest submarine fleet, a force that was created for aggressive war. "

Most of those subs were bottled up in port for the entire war. Of very dubious utility. Again, the Soviet Navy had choke points that inhibited it's usefulness. And each navy could not support the other. Not possible for combined action. The greatest sea disaster of all time was the sinking of a German merchantman carrying 8000 German refugees from East Prussia in 1944. Ship was torpedoed by a Soviet sub and sank. Only ten survivors!!

"The [Soviet] defeat at the outbreak of the war [June-September 1941] was due to the fact that the German Wehrmacht launched its surprise attack at just the moment when the Soviet artillery was being moved to the border, and together with it the corresponding supplies of munitions. The artillery was not prepared to deal with a defensive war, and on June 22 was not able to go on the offensive."

For two weeks after the June 22 date, Stalin went into seclusion and was not available for command. During this time, the cowed leadership remaining did nothing. Too afraid to take command as they might offend Stalin.

"During the first four months of the 'Barbarossa' attack, Axis forces destroyed perhaps 75 percent of Stalin's war-making ability, thereby eliminating the immediate military threat to Europe. Between July and November 1941, German forces seized or overran 303 gunpowder, munitions and grenade factories, which annually produced 85 percent of the country's entire Soviet munitions production."

The Soviets were also able to move much of their most vital weapons production equipment to the Urals and east of the Urals. Lifted the equipment from it's moorings and sent an entire factory east on a train. Took years to get production back to pre-war level, but they were able to do so.

"Also contributing substantially to the Soviet victory was the entry into the war of the United States, the substantial American aid, and, of course, the legendary stoic toughness of the Russian soldier."

With regard to the latter, I spoke on talk radio with the German officer who commanded the unit guarding the bridge in Normandy that was attacked and captured by British glider borne troops on D-Day. This German officer had extensive experience in Russia as well. This officer was of the opinion that overwhelming numbers was the main reason for German defeat. However, SS General Max Simon stated that the resolve, tenacity, and toughness of the Russian soldier was the main reason for German defeat. Probably some combination of the two is the real reason why.

"Since the publication of 'M Day,' Russian scholars have dug up additional evidence from the former Soviet archives that further confirms the Suvorov thesis and obliges a radical rewriting of Second World War history."

There is a heck of a lot of this stuff out there now! Almost too much!

"of the young men born between the years 1922 and 1925, and who were sent to war by Stalin, only three out of a hundred survived the conflict. "

This is just a staggering statistic.

"Man is so constituted that the truth, however painful, is more important in the final analysis than the spurious bliss of living in lies and ignorance. "

This is correct, but it is hard for a lot of people to accept the truth, whatever it may be.

"I have challenged the one sacred thing the Russian people still cling to -- their memory of the 'Great Patriotic War.' I have sacrificed everything dear to me to write these books. It would have been intolerable to have died without telling the people what I have uncovered. Curse the books! Curse me! But even as you curse me try to understand."

Well, this is not exactly true. The Russian people have a lot to be proud for. They did fight with great courage and determination. If they had lost, their lot would have been really bad. They can be proud of what they did for the most part.

coolbert.